Larry Harvey Speaks at Long Now Foundation

Larry Harvey (photo by Jim Urquhart, c/o Reuters)
Larry Harvey (photo by Jim Urquhart, c/o Reuters)

Burning Man co-Founder and Chief Philosophical Officer (we love saying that, it just sounds so cool) Larry Harvey was invited to speak at the Long Now Foundation on October 20, 2014. Long Now, in case you didn’t know, focuses on long-term thinking and ideas, and hosts a wonderful seminar series on a wide range of topics.

Larry spoke on “Why the Man Keeps Burning”, and his talk was very germane to current events in the Burning Man community. Listen to Larry’s talk on the Long Now site.

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51 Comments on “Larry Harvey Speaks at Long Now Foundation

  • Stone says:

    The hat Mr. Harvey wears in this picture is a Stetson Open Road, or a knock-off of that hat. The Open Road was once the most popular hat in America, primarily because there were not a lot of choices otherwise. The way one shaped and wore the brim said something about whether the wearer was a businessman, a country person, or a rancher. The way that Mr. Harvey wears the brim, as-is, just as it came out of the box, was known as the banker style. Like LBJ wore it.

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  • Tito says:

    “Why the Man Keeps Burning”

    Because of the cash free labor of the participants who are paid in intangible benefits: Inclusion (community belonging), and the promise of spiritual enlightenment as the result of providing their free labor to the company. Also social upward mobility (usually gained through backstabbing and being sycophantic). And the feeling of being better than ‘normal’ people who only ever exist in the ‘default world’ and who can’t possible relate (because of their ignorance) to the participants’ deep and meaningful experiences at the event.

    That’s why.

    And there’s a Burner born every minute.

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  • Richard says:

    Larry is really saying “The burn will live forever. Its bigger than The Beatles. And my Board will commodify it however we want. Bite me, Burners!!”

    Why is he so anxious to speak to everyone else on every other subject? Why not talk to US, the Burners who have made and continue to make Burningman so successful?

    His silence is deafening.

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  • whocares says:

    done with his philosophy, give him his retirement…from the vehicle pass fees (of course that where its coming from anyway) and send him packing. BM is way bigger than any one person. His started it but he did not make it what it is today….it was our collective creative morphing. It is ALL of us that keep the evolution going. He is not my spokesman! WE SPEAK! All burners need a voice, we need to be a radical community… we need to VOTE on issues. No more corporate governing! …….WE THE BURNERS……revolt against tyranny, yes its live and well at BM

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  • Thompson says:

    It’s sad. But what’s really sad is it never got weird enough for me. I moved to the country when the boat got too crowded. Then I learned that Larry Harvey had been eaten by white cannibals on an island near Tijuana for no good reason at all… You hear a lot of savage and unnatural things about people these days. Larry is gone now, but I don’t think I’m going to believe that until I can gnaw on his skull with my very own teeth. Fuck him! If he’s out there, I’m going to find him and I’m going to gnaw on his skull. Because it still hasn’t gotten weird enough for me.

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  • Claire says:

    We are going to redefine Fuck yer burn next year.

    FYB is no longer just for the Fing a-holes of the DPW, it is the new way to burn for many.
    They wanna play games? they wanna F up BM, then lets F it up good. Rich boy camps, we are coming for you, and DPW, you too.

    Fuck yer burn. Bring on the BM “pranksters”.

    Come on man, have a sense of humor, we are just kidding, you know… it will be fun.

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  • Peace says:

    You are no doubt reading a lot of anger over this issue and the way it has been handled. What you are hearing is fear and sorrow. That the playa is “home” to many of us is not rhetoric. We see a world sinking into a cesspool of greed and our democracy turning into an oligarchy and we found a place that was different, immune from those forces, and it gave us hope. The actions of the org with regard the wealthy and commodification camps are terrifying because they indicate a lack of integrity and understanding that could destroy the one place we have to make a stand against the soulless market that simply wants us to become consuming automatons. It appears the place, the event; the organization that stood against these negative forces is being seduced and coopted by them.

    This crack has opened up now, between the community and the org/BOD and it needs healing. We need to work together. When the non-profit was being proposed, the language the org used was, “we are gifting the event to the community”. If these are not hollow words, if the transfer is not simply an accounting trick, then the community should have a say in how the event is conducted. If you’ve really gifted it to us then we must have some ownership of it.

    You have many ways to poll the community. We all had to register to get tickets, we had to sign up to receive JRS, you have ways to contact the community and find out what they are thinking, what they want. If to do that, be sure the community will make their desires known in ways that will not be positive for the health of the event. You do not mess with the integrity of something people love without consequences. If you cater to the rich, the rich will be your only customer, only you won’t have them because the show they have come to see will have moved on.

    I believe the founders genuinely want to have a positive impact on the world but, perhaps, have failed because their egos have gotten in the way. Perhaps they believe the magic of Burning Man is in their personalities, rather than the event and the principles it is based on. That is a mistake. Principles are foundational. Without them there is no Burning Man. Break them, and you can have an event called Burning Man, but the spirit of it, the power of it, and the impact of it will fade quickly. What is implied in the principles is a level playing field. That effort is everything and wealth means nothing. In essence that virtue trumps the market place.

    Please recommit yourselves to the principles we would not have except for you. Have faith in what you created. Don’t compromise your integrity for short cuts. Don’t feel you have to force these ideals on the world. The best evangelism is to create something beautiful and let others discover it. You are pushing the river in such a way that you will soon be promoting the ideals of an event that died because you were so anxious to promote the ideals of the event. You believe this is the new mountain for you to climb, but sometimes you just get one mountain, and that should be your first priority.

    I love Burning Man. I love the people who have given it to us. I believe the org has the best wishes of Burning man in mind. They have made mistakes. Those mistakes can be remedied. I believe in you.

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  • anotherguy says:

    I listened to a bit of Larry’s talk. I’ve always admired his ability to connect and articulate the spiritual/metaphysical to the logistics of Burning Man, and how the event satisfies certain human needs. He’s really great at that, and the stuff I initially read and heard from him years ago was a big factor in my interest in BM. And, I think his guidance in that aspect have played a huge part in the event adapting to changes through the years while keeping something of its spirit alive. But, the past 3-4 years, either he’s just thrown in the towel or the lure of big money/personalities since BM entered mainstream consciousness was too strong to ignore, or perhaps the founders are just old and tired.

    Whatever the reason, nothing I’m reading from the BMORG about recent changes, including the whole non-profit Burning Man Project thing, seems to be about anything other than handing it over to individuals skilled at and interested in packaging genuine cultural artifacts into commodities. No matter that some of them are longtime burners. From what I’ve seen of them out on the playa, they bring the same entrepreneurial and resource marshaling skills to something like an art car that they bring to their commercial endeavors. Case in point: Chip Conley seems like an interesting person (and my wife and I love the hotels his previous company builds). But his new commercial endeavor, Fest300, is literally about commodifying and packaging festival attendance. And not just the already commodified music festivals, but things like Kumbh Mela in India, and yeah, Burning Man. And he’s a Burning Man Project board member. I mean, what the hell? Nothing against the guy, that’s what he’s into, but do we want someone like that in a position of influence within Burning Man? I don’t think anyone outside of the BMORG would answer yes to that question.

    There’s also a lot of talk about fundraising as a rationale for things like the donation tickets. We’re told these kinds of things help fund the big art projects, and that some of these turnkey-type camps do cool things on the playa like gifting gourmet food, etc. But to my mind, simply transporting off-playa luxuries to the playa does not contribute to a potentially transformative experience. It’s really just an ostentatious show of wealth, and requires little to no interaction. Those block-long lines for the gourmet waffles are really no different than the lines for Shake Shack burgers. Zero interaction required. Just queue up and receive product.

    As for big art, if the funds needed to produce ever bigger and more extravagant installations require any kind of compromising of principles, then it’s not worth it, in my opinion. At this point, those huge installations mainly exist as backdrops for selfies and for mainstream media outlets to use as clickbait. The smaller, more interactive and more unexpected art projects provide more joy and serendipitous moments, for my money. What would Burning Man look like with only smaller projects? It would look like Burning Man in the 90s. That’s fine by me.

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  • anotherguy says:

    Also, the sound camps. Gotta fundraise for the sound camps to get ever larger and louder because the world needs more EDM festivals. Because the ravers demand bigger louder better every year. Look, I love the sound camps, but again, if the fundraising needed to up the ante every year requires waffling on certain principles, it ain’t worth it. I’ve had just as much fun dancing at small camps with a $300 PA system as I’ve had at Opulent Temple. And I think A LOT of people can say the same thing. If you require a massive sound system and world-famous DJs to have fun dancing, maybe Burning Man isn’t for you? No wait, correction, maybe Burning Man is NOW for you.

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  • Barn Star says:

    He is like all typical greedy dictators, he has absolute power and it has gone to his head and he has ruined what he started.

    But he only started it, he did not build it to what BM is today, but he is taking ALL of the credit and ALL the money, and now, like all evil dictators he will pay the price. This is not a new human tale, it has been repeated over and over and over. Go read any of the books, see how it usually ends.

    Evil greedy men do evil greedy things, it is human.

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  • anotherguy says:

    Oh yeah, forgot about Mercedes Martinez, who is on the Burning Man Project board and is head of Global Citizenship at AirBnB, whose business model is literally about commodifying the sharing economy. Of course, that’s the business model for A LOT of tech startups, and as we all know, Silicon Valley is heavily represented at Burning Man, so maybe this whole thing is inevitable? Maybe Burning Man is just being disrupted by tech, just like the taxi industry? No, wait a sec, I have a killer business idea! Why doesn’t Uber extend their reach into Black Rock City!!?? They can jack up the rates during dust storms! Maybe we could have special Uber express lanes during exodus! Special rates apply there, as well, of course.

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  • TinaTina says:

    It has to be said because you numbskulls still don’t get it: THEY DON’T CARE ABOUT YOU! Further, they don’t give a fuck about you. Really, you’re their last concern. There are legions of people lining up to take your places who will sing the song of how great BM is and how awesome Larry and Co is. They know that. Your concerns and complaints and criticism are meaningless. You just don’t fucking get it, and perhaps never will. So it only makes me laugh when you Burners get upset or wax lyrical about the event. Either way, it’s laughable.

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  • Peace says:

    Cynicism is weak, lazy, and pointless. The power exists with the people who make the event happen. We will be heard.

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  • TinaTina says:

    @Peace

    Cynicism is the belief that all human behavior is motivated by self-interest. Hardly a weak perspective.

    You may be heard if you scream loud enough, but they will not listen to you. I’m sick of listening to you all already, and I agree with you. Your participation in inconsequential. Get it through your heads.

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  • Peace says:

    Great, you agree with us. If you aren’t going to help, get out of the way.

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  • anotherguy says:

    It’s becoming pretty clear that the move to a non-profit status and the creation of the Decommodification LLC for the stated purpose of “gifting the event back to the community” has resulted, whether intentionally or not, in the effective hand over of control from the original founding members, who for all their faults were mostly social misfits with a passion for the arts and other culture shenanigans, to people who have spent their careers finding new ways to monetize cultural artifacts and human interaction. This comment from “bubba” on burners.me sums it up nicely:

    “…everyone is scurrying around trying to figure out how to commercialize, monetize, exploit and extract ‘value’ from everything. In fact in their mind not doing this is stupid and if you don’t you are a fool. This seems to be the attitude of the BMOrg and the ‘leadership’: all the burners who donate their time, energy, creativity and passion and don’t make money off of it are rubes who should be taken advantage of. You are either exploiting or being exploited their is no gift for giving’s sake only a gift as a way of creating an environment that can then be commodified.”

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  • h.g.crosby says:

    i just figured it out.

    the recent kefluffle is really part of A SUPER SECRET SOCIAL ENGINEERING PROGRAM and we bought it hook line and stinker.

    as burning man goes, so goes the world..

    we don’t follow fashion, we make it…..we dont follow social movements, we ARE ONE…

    the REAL reason this happened was to awaken the sleeping giant of OLD SCHOOL FUCKOISM and inject it back into the community and into the world at Large…

    this is really about getting back to the old ways, the merry pranks of the CACOPHONY SOCIETY and we simply needed to be pushed, riled up in order to remember.

    well played Larry™, well played.

    if its FUCKOISM you want, it’s FUCKOISM you got baby…

    send in the clowns…

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  • hobo says:

    @h.g.crosby

    Cute. The only way you’re (we’re) going to prank this system is for regular Burners to start applying for turkey camps. It’s easy if you do it right. You’ll get placement, EA passes and unlimited tickets that you can later scalp. Just follow the same path as applying for a theme camp, but do it for turnkey. This might take some creativity, because BMorg knows this process is their weak link. Just move forward methodically, promise the moon and the stars, about how much money you’re going to bring in to BMorg as a turnkey producer. Then get your placement and EA passes and show up and tell placement that things didn’t work out as planned.

    You’ll be well on your way to a 100 x 100 placed camp in short order.

    Good luck campers!

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  • Peace says:

    Yes when hundreds, perhaps thousands, of really creative people get pissed off, things can get wonderfully weird. Especially at an event founded by people dedicated to tweaking the nose of authority. I almost want the BOD to ignore this issue just to see what shenanigans ensue. Hellco is dead…long live Hellco…

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  • JV says:

    @hobo,

    Problem is, this isn’t an issue of random and independent camps declaring themselves turnkey and asking for the now identified “turnkey exemption” from the regular theme camp registration process. This is a matter of the BMORG courting certain people and enclaves giving them preferential treatment.

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  • simon of the playa says:

    Helco Skelco.

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  • hobo says:

    @JV

    I agree. The problem could also be stated as an absence of integrity. When you deal with some person or company that shows you they have an absence of integrity, what can be done? You can’t ‘learn them’ about it, or shove integrity down their throats until they have it.

    If your significant other cheats on you, the cheating has been done. You can’t school them on why that was bad. If you don’t break up with him or her after catching them, they will simply find new ways to hide their activities. They won’t stop cheating on you.

    So if you still want to go to the Nevada burn and have your fun and try to ignore the assholes, fine. But you can also play them at their game. Sign up as a producer for 10 turnkey camps. Make some crazy shit up – BMorg will buy it if the promise of money is good enough. Block out entire massive sections on the map. The playa needs more open spaces back from the esplanade.

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  • JV says:

    @hobo

    “Sign up as a producer for 10 turnkey camps. Make some crazy shit up – BMorg will buy it if the promise of money is good enough. Block out entire massive sections on the map.”

    My point was that this won’t work because from what I know, there is no turnkey sign up process. The camps that got these backdoor ticket deals and exemptions from theme camp rules were courted directly. They did not ask to sign up. But I agree with you that if there WAS a turnkey camp sign up process, pranking it would be a wonderful idea.

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  • hobo says:

    @JV

    Yes, they don’t have a sing up process like for theme camps. It would take a bit of creative baiting to get BMorg to contact you to learn more about your turnkey camp idea. They’re hungry for money and that blinds them. Just a word here and there should do it. Then a website talking about how great the free-labor business model is, etc, just to back you up.

    Then there are the known turnkey camps. It wouldn’t be too hard to approach BMorg as a representative of one of those camps. Shouldn’t be too hard to derail the whole camp once you have them convinced.

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  • hobo says:

    Thee’s also the direct approach. Right now there are many high-profile people thinking about going to BM next year. You contact BMorg saying you represent 5 of these individuals, and that they would like to meet Larry Harvey at the event and would consider some photo opportunities. When they ask who they are, you respond with things like, ‘They would be very grateful.’ or that they would need to be able to park a 10 passenger jet plane for the duration of the week. You never tell them who your clients are. When you get them hooked, then you start increasing the number of tickets needed and space required.

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  • Peace says:

    I realize there is a lack of transparency and that is frustrating, but it doesn’t help when you respond to what you “think” is happening. Demand transparency. Demand a level playing field. Don’t go off on tangents and dark fantasies about Larry.

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  • JOJO says:

    >Demand transparency.

    What position do you think you’re in to demand anything?

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  • The new priciple, there is just one says:

    This is the song Larry and the rest of the BMorg sings
    in their head all the time these days… it is stuck in their heads.

    The best things in life are free
    But you can keep ’em for the birds and bees;

    Now give me money,
    that’s what I want,
    Yeah, That’s what I want.

    Your lovin’ give me such a thrill,
    But your lovin’ don’t pay my bills;

    Now give me money,
    That’s what I want,
    Yeah, That’s what I want.

    Money don’t get everything it’s true,
    What it don’t get I can’t use;

    Now give me money,
    (that’s what I want) that’s what I want,
    yeah, That’s what I want.

    Well, now give me money, (That’s what I want)
    A lotta money, (That’s what I want)

    Oh yeah, I wanna be free, (That’s what I want)
    Oh, lotta money, (That’s what I want)

    That’s what I want (That’s what I want) yeah,
    That’s what I want.

    Well, now give me money, (That’s what I want)
    A lotta money, (That’s what I want)

    Wo, yeah, You need money (That’s what I want)
    Gimme money, (That’s what I want)

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  • JV says:

    All credit to burnersxxx for this, I thought people here should see it too:

    Search for “Private Jet? No Problem. VIP Packages for Superfans Are Big Business for Tours & Festivals” on Google, first result is a Billboard Magazine article. Key excerpt:

    “Jennifer Breithaupt, senior vp entertainment marketing at Citi, which has worked with Billy Joel, John Legend and Katy Perry to create VIP opportunities for its cardholders, agrees, saying, “2014 is truly the year of experience for fans. There are so many unique packages offered.”

    Due to the exclusive perks they provide and the premium prices they command — from $175 for a 5 Seconds of Summer VIP experience to a whopping $50,000 for a perch on the Burning Man festival’s Billionaires Row — these packages also have become an easy target for media seeking an “us vs. them” class warfare storyline. But architects of these offerings tell Billboard that critics are missing the point.

    VIP packages, they say, are about business, not class — an opportunity to generate new revenue streams for the industry by attracting more demanding breeds of concertgoers, including “superfans,” as Breithaupt puts it, who’ve already seen the artist live “and are looking for an elevated experience.””

    See, we’re just missing the point, apparently…

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  • JV says:

    I wonder if the vaunted IP lawyers on retainer will go after this as aggressively as they’ve gone after individuals who dared, say, to include photos they took at Burning Man in their professional portfolios. Just kidding, I don’t wonder about it at all, I know they won’t.

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  • JV says:

    Forgot to include this little nugget from the Billboard article:

    “Precheur acknowledges that because he caters to “extremely rich individuals,” Billionaires Row has become “a very contentious thing, because Burning Man is supposed to be this super-hippie event” where basic tickets run from $200 to $500. But, he adds, the carping is shortsighted. Revenue from general-admission tickets pays for infrastructure, safety, traffic regulation and emergency medical expenses, but little else. “Most people miss that [Billionaires Row patrons] are the very people that fund the big art, the art cars, all the things that make Burning Man such a spectacular visual and artistic event,” says Precheur.”

    Only valid response to this is: “FUCK YOU.”

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  • James says:

    ‘“Most people miss that [Billionaires Row patrons] are the very people that fund the big art, the art cars, all the things that make Burning Man such a spectacular visual and artistic event”

    That may very well be true. All the old burners who actually brought incredible things out there have become jaded and disillusioned (to say the least) and voted with their feet a many years ago. So you now have about 70% of attendees with less than 3 years under their belts. These newbies are not producing art or other interactive installations. So is all the stuff out there being produced by the other 30% ? Some, but not most of it. It’s entirely possible that millions of dollars is being dumped into the event by special interest groups in order to maintain the facade, and eventual cash-out to some very large organization. Then they’ll let the house of cards fall.

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  • Finn says:

    Another week gone by, and still no dialogue from the bmorg. Are you just going to wait us out, and see how ticket sales go?

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  • Copeland says:

    This whole episode wont bother Mr. Philosophical. He will just get stoned and laugh at us. Sure, he sold out, but he did it according to his principles, so there is no conflict here. His Big Rule has always been “Take care of Numero Uno”. We are just all ungrateful bitches who should bow down to his wisdom and ignore this little bit of commodification.

    I hope he chokes on his new $$$ and “friends”. Weasel.

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  • Glistening says:

    ….millions of dollars is being dumped into the event by special interest groups in order to maintain the facade, and eventual cash-out…

    Make it happen this year, right now… crash this fker!!!

    The ONLY real solution is for EVERYONE to boycott this year. Dont buy tickets.

    Lets see the rich carpet baggers try to pull off their safari camps with only the rich pukes in attendance on the playa. It would be like going to the zoo and seeing empty cages. The rich pukes don’t make burning man what it is, Larry doesn’t make burning man what it is, the BM org doesnt makes burning man what it is , the Gate and DPW nasty attitude douchers dont make burning man what it is…. but it seems non of them realize that.

    Without real burners there is only desert out there.
    Fuk Larry, Fuk the BMorg, Fk the gate and DPW assholes and Fuk all the rich pukes….
    I am boycotting bruning next year and if you want to send the message you should too.

    We can post until we are blue in the face and they will not reply because THE ONLY THING LARRY AND BMorg car about is money!! Hit them in the wallet and they will reply.

    There are a lot of cool ways to spend your time in during that week. Can you imagine spending that week at the lake, pool or beach… it would be like a retro shock of no dust :)

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  • JV says:

    The event will absolutely sell out of tickets in minutes again for 2015, and for the forseeable future, no matter how many seasoned burners stop going. It will take awhile before the amount of art starts diminishing, only IF the newbies don’t start making their own. Which they will. My son and his girlfriend went for their first time in 2014, they were as blown away as all of us grizzled veterans were our first time and are already planning a project for 2015. The novelty of the event is still very strong. It’s changed but it will continue. For me, I’m probably done with it, just like 1000s before me. But there’s a Burner born every minute…

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  • Glisteniing says:

    Yeah, you are right JV, it will sell out no matter what, so they might as well charge $2000 per ticket and $4000 for the “donation” tickets and they will still sell them all. It would dumb for them to charge less.

    Why shouldn’t they make as much money as they can? It is not like anyone cares, people will still keep paying and going, after all this is fabulous Burning Man, everyone has to go see it at least once. It is a must do one everyone’s bucket list and it always sells out in minutes no matter how much they charge. Heck, they should charge $5,000 per ticket and $500 per car, it would be stupid to charge less.

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  • Elizabeth says:

    James, these “newbies” are absolutely bringing art and interaction. This was my third year, and from my very first year I have brought my own art and have participated in a theme camp.

    Everyone was a newbie once. Even you.

    Virgins can’t ruin this. Commodification can.

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  • James says:

    @Elizabeth

    The point is that newbies generally do not bring anything significant to the show. Their mere participation and helping out here and there (which is what everyone does to begin with) for the first few years is fine. It’s normal, but these people (myself included) for the first 3 years or so aren’t trucking large-scale art out the playa or converting firetrucks into art cars, etc. That’s the shit that makes the spectacle spectacular.

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  • Jimal says:

    @Glisteniing

    You’re right. Why would anyone choose to leave money on the table? Money is hard to come by. BMorg does work hard to produce the event and value is all relative. If people are willing to spend $10k for a trip out there, then that’s what it’s worth.

    The event is selling out and not necessarily in a bad way. Why shouldn’t companies throw-in and produce some amazing camps and art? Building a camp and all the things that go with it as a great team-building exercise and will make these companies better. It will make the event better and more spectacular. We all work and we all participate in the capitalist system. I say bring-it-on! Make Burning Man so insane with excess and weird experimental expensive stuff that people don’t know whether to go shit or go sailing.

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  • Peace says:

    Yeah! Why would we want any place in the world where money isn’t a factor in how you’re treated. Stop whining. The super rich are so benevolent and high minded. That’s why the world is in such great shape. Why the fuck would we want even one small place in the world where we demonstrate a way to do it better and with more integrity. Why wouldn’t we want to turn our home into the same corrupt shithole as the place we are trying to get away from? Because we can have more shinny lights and better sound systems. Goodie goodie. That seems a fair price for my soul. I’d rather go out there with real Burners even if the only are were made from popsicle sticks than pay for giant explosions by abandoning equal access. I don’t care if your wealth makes you more comfortable out there. I care really if the rich get favorable treatment when it comes to tickets. You can’t be a little bit pregnant and you can’t be a little bit corrupt.

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  • TAZ says:

    Burning Man started off as a Temporary Autonomous Zone, directed to the playa by the Cacophony Society. BM is no longer a TAZ, it’s simply a TZ now. To be fair, TAZs don’t work with numbers in the thousands – too high above the radar.

    There really is nothing stoping any group of like-minded individuals from starting a TAZ anywhere they can find to achieve that sense of autonomy. If it works out well, then do it again next year. The numbers will grow until there are just too many people, like BM 1996. BM as a TAZ was essentially dead after 96. Larry & Co just kept dragging it along year after year until it became a monster. It should have been shit-canned after 96, but non-TAZ minded people couldn’t let it go for its own sake. Greed, not just for money but status and belonging. Does anyone think most of the founders wouldn’t be homeless at this moment if they didn’t hump BM into a raging greedy beast?

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  • Moving On says:

    “You can’t be a little bit pregnant and you can’t be a little bit corrupt”.

    True Words.

    One of human’s best defense mechanisms is rationalization. Humans are experts at being able to rationalize even their worst behavior (explain why murder, rape, steal, etc was needed and required and not really bad in that instance).

    Humans can explain why any deed was OK and really, honestly, they are not bad people.
    Humans can explain the things they do because… you know… because… it was necessary.

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  • Leo says:

    So now we have 3 shills (Answergirl, Halcyon, and Will) trying to create a smokescreen to divert attention from the elephant in the room. It would be nice to hear from Larry or a board member to offer a response to the discussion on commodification (safari) camps. As much as the BMORG would like it to be, this issue will not be swept under the rug.

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  • burnersxxx says:

    “When an opponent declares: ‘I will not come over to your side,’ I calmly say, ‘your child belongs to us already. What are you? You will pass on. Your descendants, however, now stand in the new camp. In a short time they will know nothing else but this new community.” – Adolf Hitler, 1939

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  • whocares says:

    Watch larry when famous people like Charlie Rose interview him. He is not at all comfortable in his own skin, he has this boyish humbleness like he is in total awe of the interviewer (famous person). Larry has become obsessed with being around important people and has compromised his own value system to be “included” in the circles of fame! He would like all important people (wealthy, powerful, ego sensitive) to attend “his” brain child of which he claims to be the all and powerful wizard by his perceived friendships with the powerful and famous. Larry’s ego has gotten out of hand and he’s no longer in touch with the 10 principles of OUR city. He is not in-touch with burners anymore and sadly enough himself. Larry your new friends don’t really like you, you are being played, realize this ask for forgiveness and you will be welcomed back to the burner community.

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  • Dust Dancer says:

    Its all true, BM is a sell out and just looking to market itself to the masses now.

    I was disappointed when the Malcolm in the Middle episode came out and now I understand a Simpsons episode is coming out in 2 weeks. These are just more viral marketing tools of the BMorg. Marketing to tourists to come see the zoo on the Playa. Looking to attract more “what-ever-label-you-want-to-apply-to-them” to want to come out and see the show and are happy to pay to not have to abide to a single principle. And it will all make a lot more money for the people in charge.

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  • burnersxxx says:

    And, like Dr Seuss before it, The Simpsons will now be “blamed” for all the tourists coming and taking tickets away from Burners – and used to justify whatever bizarre ticket schemes that preserve prices for scalpers they can come up with for 2015.

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  • Roco says:

    >not have to abide to a single principle.

    @Dust Dancer

    There will be only a single principle in the future: Comply.

    The blowback against turnkey camps is just people blowing against the wind. It’s the motherfucking SIMPSONS! None of you, not all of you can compete in blowing against that much wind. It doesn’t matter if all the burners reading this convince their 10 best burner friends to never go back to the playa, it wont matter. It’s the motherfucking SIMPSONS! Malcome in the Middle was nothing compared to this shit.

    So complain and protest all you want. You will be replaced. And you wont be missed.

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  • Peace says:

    “When I despair, I remember that all through history the ways of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants, and murderers, and for a time they can seem invincible, but in the end they always fall. Think of it–always.” – Gandhi

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  • Leo says:

    If the BMORG chooses to commodify the event, so be it, we can live with 9 principles.
    All Volunteers should become SHORT TERM EMPLOYEES for the event. The BMORG would be subject to Nevada labor laws: 40 hour work week, breaks, overtime for work beyond 40 hours, workers compensation, etc. This would include DPW, Rangers, Gate, Airport, Post Office, Arctica, Temple Guardians, Center Camp, Lamplighters, etc.

    The BMORG appears to want it both ways: Hosting a profitable event with plenty of free labor. By choosing not to volunteer, you can send a message to the BMORG about commodification.

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